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harmfuljays
King of Men
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 938
Location: Djibouti
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 Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 10:37 am Post subject: The Flames are not particularly good |
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The Dion is not particularly good..............he needs to use that wrist shot and stop slapping the puck. His D has been down right atrocious.
Jarome has been good. That's it.
Kipper has not been good. Its hard to be good when Anders Erickson plays in front of you.......
I think Dion and Kipper are drinking beer and smoking again.....
I really can't blame this on anyone in particular......the team just isn't playing very well..........which means Keenan isn't working.
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"Don't think (Stay)
Drink your wine (Home)
Watch the fire burn (Be)
His problems not mine (Safe)
Just be that model citizen"
-The Decline
-UP THE IRONS! |
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saskhab
Morally Bankrupt Scum
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 2515
Location: Saskatoon!
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 10:41 am Post subject: |
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I can blame this on a few people:
1) Keenan.
2) A slow, plodding D.
3) Lack of effective 3rd and 4th liners (under Keenan this seems hard to believe to this day).
4) Lack of identity... this is not the lunchpail crew that it used to be, and far from it. Now that's Vancouver.
5) Kipper definitely needs to take a lot of the blame.
The good news is that if Edmonton can start to put a few wins together and go on a streak, Calgary definitely can.
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Bosc Ulrich II
OTP Resident Historian
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 2501
Location: Your own blue line!
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 10:43 am Post subject: |
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Does Keenan actually coach anymore? Teach positioning, systems, PP and PK or anything like that? Or does he just sit there screaming at people and threatening to bench everyone for screwing up when they don't even know what their job is?
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Jyrki21
Rebel Sell + Moneyball = Life
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1393
Location: Ottawa, ON
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 11:03 am Post subject: |
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Thank you for re-referencing this photograph.
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saskhab
Morally Bankrupt Scum
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 2515
Location: Saskatoon!
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 11:06 am Post subject: |
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Maybe Dion and Kipper need to start smoking and drinking beer in the back room of Cowboys again. They were actually good when they were doing that!
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Av-merican
Un-Tenured Professor of Hockey
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 1458
Location: Denver
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Bosc Ulrich II wrote: |
| Does Keenan actually coach anymore? Teach positioning, systems, PP and PK or anything like that? Or does he just sit there screaming at people and threatening to bench everyone for screwing up when they don't even know what their job is? |
I read Mellanby once got a smack in the back of his helmet for not having his stick blade-up on the bench. 
I also read Keenan never teaches the power play and never practices it. Not really sure what the hell he does to be considered a head coach, just somehow manages to light a fire under that one guy who's not realizing his talent, whether it be Thornton, Pronger, Bertuzzi, or Jokinen. Of course for every career he starts there's always at least one he ruins. |
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the New Cunning Linguist
Failed Bandwagon Opportunist
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1244
Location: I'm here, aren't I?
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:11 pm Post subject: |
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| GREY CUP CHAMPIONS!!!!!!! wrote: |
| 4) Lack of identity... this is not the lunchpail crew that it used to be, and far from it. Now that's Vancouver. |
It's interesting that after the lockout, as a run-and-gun team, Vancouver couldn't beat trapping teams like Minnesota and Calgary consistently, so they evolved into becoming a pretty good trapping team around Luongo (thanks in large part to Keenan, ironically). Now it seems, they can play Minnesota's game almost as well and occasionally, better.
Calgary tried to infuse more scoring and emulated Colorado and pre-Luongo Vancouver by adding some scoring up front - at the cost, it seems of defense...
| GREY CUP CHAMPIONS!!!!!!! wrote: |
| 5) Kipper definitely needs to take a lot of the blame. |
I really think this is a chicken-and-egg type question. If the guys in front of him suck and he's not getting help, he's at the mercy of the other team. Luongo struggled a lot to begin the season and really, it was the forwards coming all the way back to help clear the puck that really seemed to improve their team defense. Minnesota always seems to have good/great goaltending - a lot of credit has to go to the system.
And from I've heard, Keenan still doesn't practice the PP.
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... Because the old one, is well, old.
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saskhab
Morally Bankrupt Scum
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 2515
Location: Saskatoon!
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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| the New Cunning Linguist wrote: |
| GREY CUP CHAMPIONS!!!!!!! wrote: |
| 5) Kipper definitely needs to take a lot of the blame. |
I really think this is a chicken-and-egg type question. If the guys in front of him suck and he's not getting help, he's at the mercy of the other team. Luongo struggled a lot to begin the season and really, it was the forwards coming all the way back to help clear the puck that really seemed to improve their team defense. Minnesota always seems to have good/great goaltending - a lot of credit has to go to the system.
And from I've heard, Keenan still doesn't practice the PP. |
Maybe a little bit, but Kipper's numbers are awful for not just an elite goalie, but an average goalie as well. He's one of the team's two $7m players... he needs to steal some points for this team and perform well even if the team in front of him doesn't. We aren't talking about Manny Fernandez looking bad here... we're talking Miikka Kiprusoff. The guy who almost single handedly won Calgary a Stanley Cup. The guy who before he was acquired, the Flames were ridiculously bad.
He's technically awful right now... he's letting in goals he doesn't make a move on at all. He's not reading shooters well, and his style isn't one completely based on anticipating where the shot is going to go (the Allaire school). There's a lot of reaction in Kipper's style, but it's taken from an advantageous starting position on the shooters.
I also remember how when he's on his game, his ability to follow the puck is incredible. You just watch his head movements and how he sees everything. He almost ends up moving at the speed of the puck.
None of that is there. That's the kind of stuff that isn't the result of the Flames giving up more scoring chances. These are technical issues. David Marcoux (the Flames' goalie coach) said as much.
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Bosc Ulrich II
OTP Resident Historian
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 2501
Location: Your own blue line!
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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| GREY CUP CHAMPIONS!!!!!!! wrote: |
I also remember how when he's on his game, his ability to follow the puck is incredible. You just watch his head movements and how he sees everything. He almost ends up moving at the speed of the puck.
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I haven't watched him play much this year, but his ability to follow the puck is, as you said, incredible. One thing that always stood out to me in his game is his ability to pick up and stop screen shots.
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the New Cunning Linguist
Failed Bandwagon Opportunist
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1244
Location: I'm here, aren't I?
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:36 pm Post subject: |
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Well, then I can buy that... When does Vancouver play Calgary next? 
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... Because the old one, is well, old.
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Jyrki21
Rebel Sell + Moneyball = Life
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1393
Location: Ottawa, ON
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Av-merican wrote: |
| Not really sure what the hell he does to be considered a head coach, just somehow manages to light a fire under that one guy who's not realizing his talent, whether it be Thornton, Pronger, Bertuzzi, or Jokinen. Of course for every career he starts there's always at least one he ruins. |
That should be Näslund, not Bertuzzi. (Bertuzzi didn't blossom 'till a few years after Keenan was gone). Näslund's blossoming was in spite of Keenan, not because of him, though -- Keenan only put him in the lineup because of injuries.
| GREY CUP CHAMPIONS!!!!!!! wrote: |
| I also remember how when he's on his game, his ability to follow the puck is incredible. You just watch his head movements and how he sees everything. He almost ends up moving at the speed of the puck. |
I remember during the 2004 playoffs, Kelly Hrudey (I think) showed something really cool about Kiprusoff's technical game which I found fascinating. He plays the odds by positioning himself slightly off-center depending on where his defensemen are. i.e. If there's a battle going on to the right of him, he'll take into consideration the slightly greater chance for an accidentally blocked shot there and set up a little more to the left.
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Bosc Ulrich II
OTP Resident Historian
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 2501
Location: Your own blue line!
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Jyrki21 wrote: |
I remember during the 2004 playoffs, Kelly Hrudey (I think) showed something really cool about Kiprusoff's technical game which I found fascinating. He plays the odds by positioning himself slightly off-center depending on where his defensemen are. i.e. If there's a battle going on to the right of him, he'll take into consideration the slightly greater chance for an accidentally blocked shot there and set up a little more to the left. |
Yup I remember that too, and they showed it in a technique analysis in a Goalies World issue.
When I was younger I used to just knock down the guys trying to screen me and let them block the shots  I wasn't nearly as dirty as my younger brother though.
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