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Offthepost (Generation II)
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saskhab
Morally Bankrupt Scum
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 2510
Location: Saskatoon!
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razzmatazz
Go Habs Go! Vive le CH!
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1285
Location: Burnaby, B.C.
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 Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 2:26 am Post subject: |
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well done Hab fans...
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deutschlander
Morally Bankrupt Scum
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 147
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E.L.
Morally Bankrupt Scum
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1135
Location: Go Giants!
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| Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 12:34 pm Post subject: |
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Wow, I come to post this morning and find OTP has exploded from all the Hab love. Glad to see its back.
I'll try to contextualize this for everyone, as someone who spent much of the night stuck in a bar where the owner locked the door and didn't let anyone in.
1) The car burning shit was started by troublemakers who had planned this in advance. There's been a recent problem with a pro-anarchy gang that's been vandalizing police targets, and I believe they were involved
2) The other rioters who joined in suck, but there weren't too many of them
3) I was out in the streets for the initial celebration. Habs fans were high-fiving each other, honking their horns and having a good, clean time. It was only at around 1:00 AM where things got crazy
4) What is with people and national anthems? Not only should we get rid of them, but why does everyone get so caught up in flag bleeding bullshit? This was a Montreal (Canada) v. Boston (USA) game. I don't see how when a game was clearly been marketed as a battle down partisan lines, then we talk about 'class' this and 'tradition' that? It's a damn convenient time to get on a high horse
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Beat my drum down in Mexico! To Tijuana, Tijuana here we go!
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saskhab
Morally Bankrupt Scum
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 2510
Location: Saskatoon!
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| Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 12:43 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah, when "fans" come prepared to burn cars and smash windows, it's obvious it was for something else other than fan celebration. It's just picking your spots.
All that being said, hooliganism is seemingly creeping into hockey. Montreal has always had this element, but we've seen it in Edmonton ('06 playoffs, the Boston and Calgary fan beatings, and I'm sure we'll see more instances like this in the future, especially in Canada.
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It's backwards time. |
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Av-merican
Un-Tenured Professor of Hockey
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 1452
Location: Denver
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| Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 1:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Anyone show their ta-ta's? |
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E.L.
Morally Bankrupt Scum
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1135
Location: Go Giants!
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| Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 1:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Av-merican wrote: |
| Anyone show their ta-ta's? |
It's strange, it doesn't really work that way here.
When I was in your neck of the woods, college-aged men and women still lived in a phallocentric hierarchy, so guys were always attempting to prove their manliness at every opportunity and girls were sort of reacting to their new found freedom (being away from daddy) and were more inclined to flash in public/make out with other girls in public/drink jello shots from random bellybuttons. This was also why girls there would be unprepared for the eventual emotional repercussions of their actions.
Around here, where things are more Eurocentric, young women pretty much try to dress sexy all of the time, because it represents another method of gaining superiority over their sweaty male counterparts. Girls are more take charge, but conversely are almost unanimously well-tanned, wear short skirts and wear heels (even in the dead of winter).
It's a strange trade-off, but to answer your question: no, the girls don't really flash here.
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Beat my drum down in Mexico! To Tijuana, Tijuana here we go!
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Av-merican
Un-Tenured Professor of Hockey
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 1452
Location: Denver
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| Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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Damn...I really should've made the trek up to Montreal when I was still completely single...  |
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Hounsy
Reigning King of One-Liners
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 843
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| Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 1:33 pm Post subject: |
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I blame the french population and their discomfort with the concept of Victory.
I Hounsy do not support this political message that I plagiarized.
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Lang may yer lum reek! |
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Captain Chaos
(Formerly Lieutenant Chaos)
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 345
Location: Vancouver
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| Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 9:56 pm Post subject: |
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| E.L.12 more wrote: |
What is with people and national anthems? Not only should we get rid of them, but why does everyone get so caught up in flag bleeding bullshit? This was a Montreal (Canada) v. Boston (USA) game. I don't see how when a game was clearly been marketed as a battle down partisan lines, then we talk about 'class' this and 'tradition' that? It's a damn convenient time to get on a high horse |
It's about respect. Classy people have it. Even if you don't particularly like the other group, you respect the symbols of their people, most especially when they are guests in your house. |
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E.L.
Morally Bankrupt Scum
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1135
Location: Go Giants!
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 12:31 am Post subject: |
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| Captain Chaos wrote: |
| It's about respect. Classy people have it. Even if you don't particularly like the other group, you respect the symbols of their people, most especially when they are guests in your house. |
Valid point. Here's what doesn't jive with me: who is the anthem intended for?
I don't see how in a professional sports league performing the anthem makes any sense, which is why I don't think class has much to do with people's reactions.
If I booed the American anthem, does that imply that I don't respect America/Americans/American hockey players/outsiders in general? If a separatist boos the Canadian anthem, does that show a lack of class? It seems strange since said individual is involved in a political movement to separate from Canada, so why should he cheer or stand quietly?
Do the players benefit from the anthem being sung? The Canadiens, for example, have plenty of players from other countries.
Essentially the only reasons we do it are:
1) It's tradition
2) We sing it because the organizations are based out of both countries and therefore have some kind of nationalistic tie
Because of reason number 2, I then interpret the anthem singing as the equivalent of performing a team-centric theme song. In the case of game seven, the only reason the US anthem was sung was because Boston was playing, meaning to boo it is to boo the Bruins, something we'll do anyway.
If you believe in tradition, as most people do, then you remove your hat and keep quiet.
If you question this tradition, then singing the anthem becomes a pointless exercise. If you boo, then you've made the decision to question the tradition, which I have no qualms with.
That's essentially why I think singing the anthems is a bad idea and why I don't believe the process to be a celebration of other people's symbols. It's merely a partisan gesture.
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Beat my drum down in Mexico! To Tijuana, Tijuana here we go!
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Captain Chaos
(Formerly Lieutenant Chaos)
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 345
Location: Vancouver
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:07 am Post subject: |
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From my understanding of your points:
1. Anthems shouldn't be played at NHL hockey games.
2. Anthems played at NHL hockey games are fair game for disrespectful behavior because they cease to become national anthems and are rather a symbol of the opposing team.
Though I personally like the Anthems played at the beginning of the game your first point is fair game for debate.
I think your second point is just rationalizing rude and boorish behavior that I believe is universally considered as such. I suppose if the fans in any city lacked the self-control to restrain themselves and remain respectful or polite through the anthems then perhaps maybe they shouldn't be played there - though in my opinion that would be a pretty sad statement as to the civility of those fans. |
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razzmatazz
Go Habs Go! Vive le CH!
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1285
Location: Burnaby, B.C.
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:13 am Post subject: |
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| They're Hab fans, consider the source. Canuck fans did it in retaliation; Habs fans do it because they're Hab fans... |
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E.L.
Morally Bankrupt Scum
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1135
Location: Go Giants!
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:10 am Post subject: |
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| Captain Chaos wrote: |
| I think your second point is just rationalizing rude and boorish behavior that I believe is universally considered as such. I suppose if the fans in any city lacked the self-control to restrain themselves and remain respectful or polite through the anthems then perhaps maybe they shouldn't be played there - though in my opinion that would be a pretty sad statement as to the civility of those fans. |
True, I suppose the actions are considered rude by most, but if anything I think the act of performing the anthem to be in poor taste as well. For what other purpose than to get people excited on jingoism is there in playing the anthem? How does it honour our country? Why are we honouring our country?
Olympics - yeah, I get it, but the NHL is about individual cities. If each city had their own anthem, would anyone think less of a Habs fan who booed the "Boston" anthem? Probably not.
Playing the anthem sends a mixed message that doesn't correspond to the actual event, so I don't think booing an anthem represents a sign of disrespect towards another persons' country. If you booed the anthem of a gold medal winner at the Olympics - yes,that would be terribly rude. NHL game, when we're being goaded into "Go Habs Go" chants, being told to make noise, supposed to boo when the opposing team scores, or boo a botched penalty, it just seems hypocritical to then say the anthem singing (especially when some anthem singers are fist pumping to the home team's anthem) is of some sacred value.
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Beat my drum down in Mexico! To Tijuana, Tijuana here we go!
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saskhab
Morally Bankrupt Scum
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 2510
Location: Saskatoon!
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:29 am Post subject: |
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| E.L.12 more wrote: |
| If each city had their own anthem, would anyone think less of a Habs fan who booed the "Boston" anthem? Probably not. |
If Montrealers booed "More Than A Feeling"? Man, that would be bad taste.
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It's backwards time. |
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