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the New Cunning Linguist
Like a good neighbor, but not
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1635
Location: I'm here, aren't I?
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razzmatazz
Go Habs Go! Vive le CH!
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1634
Location: Burnaby, B.C.
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 Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Works for me, the more coin they wanna tie up in players past their prime, you go for it... |
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Bosc Ulrich II
OTP Resident Historian
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 3205
Location: Sweetest lid in the league
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| Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 10:09 pm Post subject: |
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| razzmatazz wrote: |
| Works for me, the more coin they wanna tie up in players past their prime, you go for it... |
And if you want to sign a guy who finished ahead of him in Norris voting once in his career for 3 more years and more money, go ahead...
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razzmatazz
Go Habs Go! Vive le CH!
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1634
Location: Burnaby, B.C.
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| Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 3:37 am Post subject: |
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| He'll be 30 and 31, not 40 and 41. You sign for the future, not the past. Detroit doesn't have the luxury of doing both anymore... |
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the New Cunning Linguist
Like a good neighbor, but not
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1635
Location: I'm here, aren't I?
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| Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 8:29 am Post subject: |
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| razzmatazz wrote: |
| Works for me, the more coin they wanna tie up in players past their prime, you go for it... |
"Past their prime?"  Since 2000/01, Lidstrom has won the Norris five times, no one else has won it more than once since then. And all while he was in his 30s... And I can't see anyone else even coming close to him in voting at the end of the season. He may be 37, but he's a damned sight better than every other defenceman in the league...
| razzmatazz wrote: |
| He'll be 30 and 31, not 40 and 41. You sign for the future, not the past. Detroit doesn't have the luxury of doing both anymore... |
So, you're saying, you'd rather overpay now, for someone who hasn't won anything - Norris, Stanley, Hart or whatever (well, he did win the hardest shot competition, I'll give him that...), and hope for the best, than reward performance and results... Nice...
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... Because the old one, is well, old.
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Av-merican
Un-Tenured Professor of Hockey
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 1955
Location: Denver
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| Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 11:31 am Post subject: |
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| I'd take a "past his prime" Lidstrom any day on my squad. |
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Bosc Ulrich II
OTP Resident Historian
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 3205
Location: Sweetest lid in the league
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| Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 1:52 pm Post subject: |
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Seriously, this is like the Monty Python black knight grasping at straws...
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razzmatazz
Go Habs Go! Vive le CH!
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1634
Location: Burnaby, B.C.
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| Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 7:44 pm Post subject: |
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For the 151,234th time, 23 teams made offers on Chara, some higher than what he took to go to Boston. We hardly overpaid.
And yes, I'd rather pay for future play than past play - that's the whole point of the GM excercise...
Sure I'd love an over the hill Lidstrom on my team too... but not for that much for 2 more years... |
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Bosc Ulrich II
OTP Resident Historian
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 3205
Location: Sweetest lid in the league
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| Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 8:37 pm Post subject: |
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| razzmatazz wrote: |
For the 151,234th time, 23 teams made offers on Chara, some higher than what he took to go to Boston. We hardly overpaid.
And yes, I'd rather pay for future play than past play - that's the whole point of the GM excercise...
Sure I'd love an over the hill Lidstrom on my team too... but not for that much for 2 more years... |
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razzmatazz
Go Habs Go! Vive le CH!
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1634
Location: Burnaby, B.C.
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 12:29 am Post subject: |
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| well done |
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Bosc Ulrich II
OTP Resident Historian
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 3205
Location: Sweetest lid in the league
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| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 1:41 pm Post subject: |
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| razzmatazz wrote: |
| well done |
Thanks 
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Lillith
Forum Witch
Joined: 20 Oct 2007
Posts: 421
Location: Second Star to the Right
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| Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 1:14 am Post subject: |
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| razzmatazz wrote: |
| Works for me, the more coin they wanna tie up in players past their prime, you go for it... |
razz, I can't believe you said that. "Past his Prime"??? Bujeezus, Boy - what have you been smoking?
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No one can make you feel inferior without your permission. |
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razzmatazz
Go Habs Go! Vive le CH!
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1634
Location: Burnaby, B.C.
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| Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 3:59 am Post subject: |
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| He's still one of the top 5 D men in the league, I'd kill to have him on my team, don't get me wrong. But that much money when he'll be 40??? No thanks... |
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Av-merican
Un-Tenured Professor of Hockey
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 1955
Location: Denver
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| Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 11:41 am Post subject: |
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| razzmatazz wrote: |
| He's still one of the top 5 D men in the league, I'd kill to have him on my team, don't get me wrong. But that much money when he'll be 40??? No thanks... |
I think in this new era of the NHL we shouldn't so much look at the monetary amount as the number of years. It's only two, I don't see it being something that the Red Wings will come to regret. The only way I see Detroit getting bitten in the ass from it is if for whatever reason Lidstrom suddenly retires...I believe since he signed the contract past the age of 35 the cap hit is still taken whether he suits up or not...isn't that the rule? Mind you I'm reaching here, I seriously doubt that'll happen. |
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Bosc Ulrich II
OTP Resident Historian
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 3205
Location: Sweetest lid in the league
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| Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 11:50 am Post subject: |
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| Av-merican wrote: |
| razzmatazz wrote: |
| He's still one of the top 5 D men in the league, I'd kill to have him on my team, don't get me wrong. But that much money when he'll be 40??? No thanks... |
I think in this new era of the NHL we shouldn't so much look at the monetary amount as the number of years. It's only two, I don't see it being something that the Red Wings will come to regret. The only way I see Detroit getting bitten in the ass from it is if for whatever reason Lidstrom suddenly retires...I believe since he signed the contract past the age of 35 the cap hit is still taken whether he suits up or not...isn't that the rule? Mind you I'm reaching here, I seriously doubt that'll happen. |
Yeah, if he retires, the amount counts no matter what, which is probably why the deal isn't any longer than 2 years.
7.45 for two years is fine for the best Dman in the league. Best in his own zone. One of, if not the top in the opposition zone. Plays 28 minutes night in, night out, always against the opponents top line, always on the PP, always on the PK, always healthy(has missed 22 games in 15 seasons), at least half of those near the end of the season for rest. Monster in the playoffs. Probably the lowest maintenance player in the league who helps the coaches and his fellow D more than he needs any coaching at all. That he will be 40 at the end of this deal really doesn't mean a thing.
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Av-merican
Un-Tenured Professor of Hockey
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 1955
Location: Denver
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| Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 11:52 am Post subject: |
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| Bosc Ulrich II wrote: |
| 7.45 for two years is fine for the best Dman in the league. Best in his own zone. One of, if not the top in the opposition zone. Plays 28 minutes night in, night out, always against the opponents top line, always on the PP, always on the PK, always healthy(has missed 22 games in 15 seasons), at least half of those near the end of the season for rest. Monster in the playoffs. That he will be 40 at the end of this deal really doesn't mean a thing. |
If he takes conditioning tips from Chelios it certainly won't mean anything. |
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hipcheck
Wears red stockings
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 535
Location: The Box
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| Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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| razzmatazz wrote: |
For the 151,234th time, 23 teams made offers on Chara, some higher than what he took to go to Boston. We hardly overpaid.
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Yes, they did (overpay). It doesn't matter how many teams were also overbidding for his "services"
| Quote: |
| Sure I'd love an over the hill Lidstrom on my team too... |
I'd take an "over the hill" Lidstrom over Chara, at any stage of his career
He will never be the equal of Lidstrom, unless Lidstrom sadly hangs around through his twilight - and even still, by then Chara should be also regressed
To truly appreciate a players value (or lack of) you have to watch them play - live, and preferably at the same time.
Chara got what market drove, but by comparison to his "peers" he is way,way,way,way,way overpaid , by a team desperate to win back even some of it's fan base.
Savard on the other hand, turned out to good signing ( $ to performance) [/b]
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I'm a Bruins fan - don't try to confuse me with the facts |
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razzmatazz
Go Habs Go! Vive le CH!
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 1634
Location: Burnaby, B.C.
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| Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 10:26 pm Post subject: |
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You guys are being far too hard on Chara. He's the leader of what on paper is an unproven defense core to say the least. Yet the team is doing exceedingly well. I would point out that not only did he have a goal and an assist, but he also shut down Ovechkin and company in our 2-0 win tonight. What more do you want?
Again, it's not all about the names, it's about how they play. Lidstrom at 40 is a very relevant point, and Chara, given that he was an UFA, was absolutely worth the money they paid... |
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Bosc Ulrich II
OTP Resident Historian
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 3205
Location: Sweetest lid in the league
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| Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 9:57 am Post subject: |
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| razzmatazz wrote: |
Again, it's not all about the names, it's about how they play. |
Thanks for making my point
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